Curse

moriz · Sep 30, 2009, 02:56 AM // 02:56

mesmers are primarily designed to play mindgames against other human opponents in pvp. their skillset is perfectly suited for that. unfortunately, AI does not have minds, so you can't play mindgames against them in PvE. they are then reduced down to two aspects: interrupts, and generic hexes. interrupts themselves are unreliable, especially since in HM with fastcasting on everything. not to mention, there's nothing stopping other professions from going /Me and use those interrupts to equal effect. that leaves hexing, which the mesmer is unfortunately weaker than the necromancer in almost every front.

basically, you play mesmer in pve if you want to do something different, or want to challenge yourself in some way or another.

byteme! · Sep 30, 2009, 03:46 AM // 03:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Drunkard

I use auspicious incantation, etap, and drain enchant and I usually have no problems with emanagement, as long as I don't spam skills on recharge.

Prime example of why Inspiration Magic is trash. 3 skill slots dedicated for energy which leaves 5 slots for a rez and 4 slots filled with (assumption) long recharging skills. Besides Drain enchantment the other 2 serve no purpose for your team other then yourself. What makes this even worse is you stated you can't spam skills on recharge even after dedicating 3/8ths of your bar for energy and this is coming from a class known for it's long recharging skills.

Leadership, Expertise, Energy Storage, Critical Strikes, Soul Reaping, Mysticism...this is what other classes have to offer for energy management which in my mind is far superior to Inspiration.

Heck I can hop on my Mesmer and never run out of energy while I'm playing too. Does this prove that my Mesmer is good? $%&^ no!

Cuilan · Sep 30, 2009, 05:49 PM // 17:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by moriz

there's nothing stopping other professions from going /Me and use those interrupts to equal effect. that leaves hexing, which the mesmer is unfortunately weaker than the necromancer in almost every front.

You would want to have fast casting...

I don't really agree with mesmer having weaker hexes. A mesmer can make quite a bit of damage without having to rely on another character/player. Mark of Pain is garbage in many maps.

Quote:

Originally Posted by byteme!

3 skill slots dedicated for energy which leaves 5 slots for a rez and 4 slots filled with (assumption) long recharging skills.

I never have builds with more than 1-2 energy skills. You don't always need a bar of all attack spells because it doesn't mean you're doing more. It's like seeing a dervish with 6 attack skills on one bar or a monk with 7 heal skills.

moriz · Oct 01, 2009, 02:12 AM // 02:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cuilan

You would want to have fast casting...

I don't really agree with mesmer having weaker hexes. A mesmer can make quite a bit of damage without having to rely on another character/player. Mark of Pain is garbage in many maps.

I never have builds with more than 1-2 energy skills. You don't always need a bar of all attack spells because it doesn't mean you're doing more. It's like seeing a dervish with 6 attack skills on one bar or a monk with 7 heal skills.

fast casting on .25s interrupts? not that useful. if you can't twitch a skill with a .25s interrupt, you'll likely not be able to twitch it with a .175s interrupt also. and let's face it, PvE is generally not time intensive, so fast casting is of very little use there.

there aren't a lot of good mesmer hexes in PvE, simply because so many of them are geared towards single targets. necromancer hexes are much better in this regard, since a lot of the good ones are AoE. at the end of the day, i'd still want a necro primary hexer, purely because of soul reaping.

The Drunkard · Oct 01, 2009, 02:45 AM // 02:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by byteme!

Prime example of why Inspiration Magic is trash. 3 skill slots dedicated for energy which leaves 5 slots for a rez and 4 slots filled with (assumption) long recharging skills.
.

Sorry, should've clarified. When I run a build, I'll pick one of those skills to use to manage energy. Most of the inspiration line is weak due to the nerfs and useless function; it still isn't hard to maintain energy on a bar.

Quote:

Originally Posted by byteme!

HAK I CAN HOP ON MAH MESM3R AND NEVER RUN OUT OF EN3RGY WHIEL IMM PLAYNG 2!!!!!1!! OMG WTF LOL DOES THES PROVA TAHT MAH MASMAR SI GOD??!??? WTF LOL $%&^ NO!!1!!1!1! OMG WTF
.

Please quote me where I said mesmers were strong in PvE. The mesmer needs a rework of many of its skills in PvE if it ever wants to become more than just the CoP or AP spam. I still like the class and have no problems being inferior to other teams.

Cuilan · Oct 01, 2009, 06:25 AM // 06:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by moriz

PvE is generally not time intensive, so fast casting is of very little use there.

Fast casting lets you cast damage skills while enemies are closer together, still alive, at the right time, gives potential to fit more skills in the same amount of time, and allows you to finish casting if you're moving back from possible danger.

Daesu · Oct 01, 2009, 06:35 AM // 06:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cuilan

Fast casting lets you cast damage skills while enemies are closer together, still alive, at the right time, gives potential to fit more skills in the same amount of time, and allows you to finish casting if you're moving back from possible danger.

Keeping the enemies closer is a task that can be accomplished by minion tanking, giving you time to finish casting your spells, even without fast casting, while stupid PvE monsters attack your minions.

If the monster AI were to be smarter, then PvE would be more like PvP and mesmers would be more valued in PvE.

Furthermore, monsters in HM have higher life, and level with extra energy regen. This makes energy denial less useful and require more spells to be cast before a HM monster dies compared to PvP. This makes energy more important.

Cuilan · Oct 01, 2009, 06:37 AM // 06:37

Because everything goes exactly as you want and smoothly in Guild Wars. Fast casting is reliable.

Daesu · Oct 01, 2009, 06:44 AM // 06:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cuilan

Because everything goes exactly as you want and smoothly in Guild Wars. Fast casting is reliable.

On the contrary because PvE is so predictable you can take your time to cast your spells if you have the proper backups in place (e.g. minions to tank for you).

Cuilan · Oct 01, 2009, 06:58 AM // 06:58

I wasn't really posting on how predictable enemies are exactly...

Daesu · Oct 01, 2009, 07:01 AM // 07:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cuilan

Or you can stand there an just not do anything at all except attacking with your staff while other people or H/H fight...

Sure that is often done with discordway but you kill faster if you help out with pve skills and AP. You need energy to spam kill fast more than you need fast casting which is why soul reaping rules in PVE.

Tenebrae · Oct 01, 2009, 07:26 AM // 07:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by moriz

there aren't a lot of good mesmer hexes in PvE, simply because so many of them are geared towards single targets. necromancer hexes are much better in this regard, since a lot of the good ones are AoE. at the end of the day, i'd still want a necro primary hexer, purely because of soul reaping.

No one argues about SR being best primary att for a caster in PvE , its stupidly overpowered but about hexes ..... make no mistake pal. Necro is not better because its AoE function , its because they are "general purpose" hexes. So when you make a necro build you dont really think "hey , im going to focus in killing X kind of mob" , just take SS , enfeebling blood , weaken armor , bla bla bla and it works on any mob but when it comes to focus on killing X kind of mob .....mesmer will turn them to ashes way faster than necro.
Thats the issue , mesmer is an ANTI-X or a counter-X while necro is a general hexer to screw all kinds of mobs. Being "general" and "good" or "suitable" on almost all places makes you really good ( like Discord/Sab ways ) but again , make no mistake , doesnt make you BETTER in all situations to a well suited-for-the-area/mission team.